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Pompey Supporters Trust - Monday meeting

I have literally just walked through my door, well not even my door - my brothers door just outside of Exeter - having been to the latest Pompey Supporters Trust meeting, one that I am VERY glad I went to.

Living where I do, here in Devon - and a non-driver - it makes attending meetings difficult. I had planned to go to the first one, as I was in Pompey, but illness prevented this, the second was one I could not make, so although I felt somewhat of an 'outsider', I am glad that I took Ken up on his invitation to go and an offer of a lift back to my brothers on his way back as it was WELL worth it!

Some essential elements of this Supporters Trust, which in fully recognised now as of the end of December 2009, were confirmed and some other interesting information, from some very well informed and passionate Pompey fans was found out.

A fee of JUST 5 across the board for everyone has been set - this 5 gives you a yearly membership and entitles you to 1 share in the Pompey Supporters Trust, legal requirements limit you just to this, it does not matter if this is the only contribution that you make, and you can make further donations, 1 share is all you can get and this entitles you to the same voice as ANYONE else, no matter how much they put in.

There will have to be a board, or committee in place, but these are not 'self appointed' as such, of course there needs to be a working committee, but it is vitally important to stress that these are very much working to the 'for the fans by the fans' motto and ARE all as passionate about the club as you or I. This is about fans looking out for the clubs best interest.

Clearly a few areas still need to be ironed out and some fine tuning done but this is something that can ONLY benefit us as supporters and allow us to help the club that we all love.

This 5 annual membership fee will see you issued with an individually numbered certificate, which you download and print online or have posted to you - via 2nd class postage - so you really do feel like you have a stake in something, and this Supporters Trust does give us a good chance of having some say in our club, but also helping organise events and so on in the local community, with the community also very important to the club.

There was of course some passionate debate going on, but once again I stress this is because it involved people who care so much about the club - so for us as a club to be setting this up, or properly done and with guideline help from those who know the ins and outs of the Supporters Trust and how it works, so long as this is done in the right way, as I feel it WILL be, we cannot lose.

A big announcement at the start of the meeting saw it revealed by Colin Farmery that SAF been in contact with him, as he has regularly, and it is proposed that his 10% stake in the club go to the Supporters Trust!

Although quite how this works, and what he is looking for in return for this is unknown at this point although he feels that it is important that the club bring on board the Supporters Trust to be more sustainable and that it is important for the local community to play a part in the club to have a greater transparency.

SAF is a non-executive board member so if, and as said this is something that if far from ironed out, his 10% stake is gained by the Pompey Supporters Trust it 'could' bring a seat on the board - which I guess would be filled by SAF? Although he WILL NOT become the head of the Trust even if this happens. There are still plenty of issues to be ironed out on this one, as no one really knows what he wants, if anything, for this 10% and what it would mean to the Trust?

More on this SAF issue will follow...

There were several legal minds at this meeting who know a fair amount out 'winding-up orders' and 'administration', with it thought that the worse case scenario for Pompey with this winding up petition issued recently, and the court date in February - which 'should' make the true extent of debts known - most likely seeing this court adjourned as would probably happen again, and again, with it unlikely that the club will be wound-up. Administration, although also unlikely - all being well as it is NOT only the club that suffers, those owed money, plenty of which are local businesses could be seriously affected too - is probably the worst case scenario, even then it is not thought that this would happen, and neither is thought to be that close, talk of weeks or months is most probably wide of the mark...

Further news announced revealed, from a person who would know as they are employed by the club, that debts - all be it at the lower end are starting to be paid off, which is a good sign and more importantly probably meaning that those, maybe local to the club that probably need this more than most, are starting to be looked after?

Whatever though, debts starting to be paid is a positive step, right?

The MOST important thing that we look at here though is the Supporters Trust itself, lets not get sidetracked by other issues.

This IS happening and will be a good thing, as mentioned it needs a little tweaking and fine tuning and full disclosure, which I would hope we get, but will be in very, very good shape in time for the next planned meeting. So, I would urge those that CAN make it to attend the next open meeting at The Riffle Club on Tuesday 19th January at 7.30pm.

An official date for the launch of The Trust is not known at this point, although I would imagine that it is not far off at all and would be known at the next meeting, which again IS open to anyone.

PLAY UP POMPEY!


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The Journalist

Writer: pompeyrug Mail feedback, articles or suggestions

Date:Tuesday January 5 2010

Time: 2:01AM

Your Comments

All sounds very organised but what I don't umderstand is how the Trust GET A VOICE .. (with or without SAF) Surely the club has to accept the Trusts money in order for it be to 'recognised' - If the club choose not to do that then the Trust has no voice .. Or am I wrong? .. Also let's say the Trust gets 10,000 members at 5 a head .. that's 50k ..where does the money go and what's the difference between the trust giving 50k to the club or me doing it individually .. I guess those of us that can not make the meetings are gonna need a lot more information before we can share your enthusiasm and optimism
Chix
Good effort for making it Rug,like Chix I'm sceptical as to what clout this would give us, SAF sems like he has been sidelined by it all, if he was to give up his 10%, surely thats his ties severed?
paultsmouth
The trust is a good idea to a point, they have a voice that the papers will speak to and that reduces tension and consequently the risk of fans turning nasty but that tends to be where the influence ends; unless you get a director who is willing to represent the trust's views. By the way; would that be the same SAF that every one was slaughtering a weekago?
russellm
ditto folks....even the vastly superior fan base of Liverpool struggled
plymouth graham
Good Report Rug i already voiced my opinions to Ken when i met him & the Arsenal Game as i dont think it will work , he is very passionate about the trust .i explained to Ken that ive been involved with Trusts & committees for over 30years , Ken asked me if i would get more involved with his one but i declined as ive only ever been on one that actually worked its a thankless job & all members seldom agree on what should happen . i wish him luck with his venture & hes more than welcome to have my fiver
sea-juicer
Despite the sceptism of some this is a good move and thanks to Rug for a detailed report. VP need a representative to attend all these meeting and report back as communications are vital. Good news that some local creditors are being paid, I gather a few local companies were told that they would be paid in 90 days rather than the usual 30 days and some said they wanted to give Pompey credit but simply could not afford to.
eastneydave
Thanks for the report, Rug. Did the people with 'legal minds' rather than financial minds have anything more concrete to convince you that we wouldn't go into administration this season?
wellyit
i am not going to claim to be an expert on this, as i am not - i planned to go from the start but illness prevented this, what i would say is it is VERY good to experience this first hand, you cannot beat actually being there so with this next one very, very much a public meeting this gives those that can attend a much better idea of what actually is going on - in all honesty even if SAF 'gives' his 10% to the pompey trust this may well not assure the trust a place on the board, but it maybe could, altho this is not the main issue at present really is it - altho it is a good thing, then again is it just a 'publicity' thing for SAF, who we all know loves this, but we also know he most probably is not the evil doer than so many thought...
something is being done in the hope of having ALOT of people in place, and bare in mind we had 250,000 at the victory parade a couple of years back, if half of them put in a fiver each that is not bad going, a world wide audience gives a starting base that is impressive and 'potentially' some of those thinking of getting involved are 'meant' to have some serious clout behind them?
i will say that i came away from this meeting alot more relaxed about the clubs position, and those that know how winding-up order etc. made me feel alot more easy about the thoughts connected to winding up or even admin - which, i will admit still does seem a possiblilty, but not as much of an immediate one as might have seemed.
pompeyrug
to be fair these legal minds seemed pretty financially minded too - altho straying from the point too much was not what they wanted to do.
pompeyrug
yes but with 10% wouldnt the trust have to put in 10% of what alfarhj puts in from now on?? i know thats nothing but what if he puts in 10m
pompeyhussler
u can only buy 1 share though !!! if u could buy more shares people would obviously put more money in and we may get a few rich people buying 100s maybe 1000s.
pompeyhussler
whats the diffence between the share holders arsenal?? why dont we have shares which have value to them and we could sell ? which go down and up in value as the club does? then people would put more money into it ..
pompeyhussler
I was at the meeting and thought the gesture of 10% of the club's shares is something to build on.
FACup Triumph
Excellent report Rug. Al Fahim's apparent offer is thought -provoking at least. It certainlt reassures me that one of the 'players' is taking the Trust seriously already. Whether it will ever happen - well I'm sceptical to say the least. Chix and paultsmouth both ask what voice a Trust would have and there is no easy answer. IF the Trust had shares then at least we could attend AGMs and EGMs; in fact in certain circumstances we could even call EGMs; we would have to be informed of major actions even if we could not directly influence them. But, even without shares, the bigger the Trust the more noise it can make, the more media coverage it gets and ultimately, the more it can influence the Club. At least it would mean that we had an organisation in place to resurrect a Portsmouth football club if the worse were to happen to this one. And there I'm afraid, I do not share Rug's optimism. Administration before the March deadline for points deduction, seems a distinct possibility to me. Agreed they will hold it off as long as they can in the hope of retaining our Premiership position but if they think we are going down then they will opt for the 9 point deduction this season and heaven help the small creditors who are likely to end up with just pennies in the pound. Although, Inland Revenue, banks and football clubs must be paid in full, I presume that Gaydamak's 28 million would be part of the 'other creditors' payment and he would only get a pecentage. Whatever the financial position at our Club, a Trust can be benificial to all, working to improve links with the local community as well as attempting to influence the Club. Take a minute to check the Supporters' Direct website www.supporters-direct.org/ and come to the open meeting on the 19th or put your questions on here for Rug or myself to ask. We will also be looking for committee members so if you've time to spare and wish to stand for election let us know.
Ken Malley
While I am usually a massively sceptical person, I do agree that even if no-one listens to the voice, it's worth having that voice in the first place. Is it worse being ignored or being mute? Possibly there's not much in it but you have NO chance of being heard if you never utter.
hammersmithblue
...however, I wouldn't trust Al Fahim further than I could throw the tellytubby. It's all a scam, isn't it?
hammersmithblue
I'm not sure where I stand on this venture to be honest! However; it surely is better to have a voice than none at all. It seems impossibly complicated to implement to me, i'm just not sure how the co-op is ever going to be one voice? I've sat on committees, and by God they are difficult! you never seem to please all the people all the time, they normally tend to pull in different directions. Good to see Ken is being a realist as regards to the immediate future for us, thats a good base to build on! at least if the people who could run it are aware of the real issues then we could move forward.
pentonpompey
Hussler PFC would have to float as a plc for that to happen. At the moment it's privately owned. The supporters trust is a different thing.
PFCblue
Rug .. if half the 250,00 put a 5 in (which I really doubt) that's 625,000 a year .. If Utaka is on the reported 80k pw (which I also really doubt.. but let's just say).. then that means the trust will have the equivalent buying power of two months of Utaka wages .. not really enough for Al-fahaj to sit up and listen is it ?... For me the Trust is best served organising itself in case we go into adminstration rather than trying to influence those currently at the helm... If (as we hope) administration is avoided then a different direction can be established but to fight on too many fronts at once when you have no power isn't that wise...
Chix
Chix, i may be wrong, and as said i have not been at all meetings, it is not my understanding that looking to 'influence' those in charge is what the trust is trying to do more to offer that back-up plan and at least have the opportunituty of looking to act...remember we are going global on this, the more exposure the trust gets the more worldwide fans that 'could' sign up there will be? 10,000 would be a fantastic starting point, and why should it not happen eh?

hussler it is also my understanding that it is a legal obligation of the trust that you can ONLY have 1 share in this trust for your annual fee, this is the way it works if people wish to donate more to the trust they are free to do so - i think 'taking over the club' is something that people needs to put out of their minds as it is not going to happen is it, well not while we are still avoiding admin, or worse...

FACT, were you the guy in the yellow jacket at the back of the room? when a guy started talking about the club you took on and so on i instantly thought that must have been you?
pompeyrug
Rug .. How can it go really global when (as Ken stated) only those present at meetings can vote on issues - That in itself isolates anyway outside of (say) Southern England ... One man one vote .. as long as you can attend the meetings ... And 10,000 fans paying a 5 would raise 50k to do what with exactly .. Sorry to be negative but until I can see what the aims of the Trust are and how I can participate (wherever in the world I choose to live) I can't see what it has to offer Pompey Supporters ..
Chix
Chix 5.00 = 3 pies the ammount you eat at every home game so whats the fuss about give ken your money or shall i give it to him for you .IF ??????? its help PFC then its woth every penny unlike your pies
sea-juicer
rug i would rather us fans rasie 50k for a childrens charity or something at least it would make a diffence . whats 50k gonna do utakas wages for 4 days
pompeyhussler
I must say, I'm a bit of a sceptic. That said, thanks Rug for the report, and whatever I can do, I will....and henceforth I have a Fiver (or 3 pies) with the trusts name on it. "Every little Counts"........sorry - bl**dy supermarkets ! PUP
BarneyArmy
I like the idea of having an organised fans group like this, and will probably join it, although I don't know how many meetings I'm likely to get to, if any. Not sure what to make of SAF's offer, it sounds good. If the Trust is given 10% of the business then surely they will have a seat on the board, even if its not enough for any real influence. But SAF has been too good to be true in the past, and may be so again. Does it also mean the Supporters Trust would then own 10% of PFC's debts as well? As for fans clubbing together to raise money for the club, I would not be adverse to seriously dipping into my bank account if I thought it would really help Pompey's cause. But anything would be a drop in the ocean. If we paid off one debt another would raise its head. And there's the danger of the money going, if not to a mysterious arab, then a banged-up russian-israeli.
tracyc
is it limited to just those at meetings tho? there is a website being created so why can people not have a vote on that? i am not up to speed, as said previously, so i do not know all the ins and outs but IF limited to just those in the southern area then what would be the point...
altho, if 'something bad' happened at least the trust would be on hand to lend a helping hand, and maybe not limited just to the club, possibly the local businesses too affected by wrong doings?

re: the 10% and the ST then taking on 10% of the clubs debt, it was my understanding that this most 'likely' would not be the case...
pompeyrug
Chix/Rug. Electronic voting and proxy votes are on the agenda. I, for one, cannot afford the 360 mile round trip to attend every meeting in the future. The Trust is very much in its infancy, but I'm confident that we can find the people to take it forward in a way that is representative of Pompey fans in general.
Ken Malley
Best of luck Pompey fans. You don't deserve this.
Nellup
You lot are down! You heaped scorn and abuse on my second favorite side...Southampton...only to end up just like them. C'mon now, take the pts deduction and go down to the Champ'ship and get over this Admin nightmare like nice little boys. On the other hand, you can look fwd to paying fewer quid on football matches. I hear they dont charge much at Conf Lge grounds. What goes around comes around...and Southampton will pass you on your way DOWN!!! LOL
blues first
Firstly we haven't yet ended up like Southampton. To remind you they are currently TWO leagues below Pompey, who haven't actually been relegated yet. Secondly how they can pass us when they will still be playing AT LEAST one division below us next season. Thirdly if Southampton can turn it around why can't we, without the need for consecutive relegations or close to it. Not everybody that follows Pompey actually hate Southampton, but after years of ridicule and long suffering as the inferior South Coast neighbour, we have finally righted that situation, not only in terms of league status, but also in the trophy department (namely FA Cups and Top Flight Titles). So finally the Supporters Trust. Anything has to be a good thing, as Oscar Wilde once said "There is only one thing worse than being talked about, and that is, not being talked about". Open dialogue has to be a positive step, and this can be the means that takes us our Club to another level. Good Luck to all concerned.
pompeygray
How did this mess come about, It is truly dire and sold down the river by that Joker who was shown the door at City by their owners, who discovered well in time he was just a joke. What did The previous owners do to ensure that the club was sold to someone with honour.
buzz lightyear
Will the last person to leave Portsmouth please turn out the lights.
Jinkin Jimmy Dimmock
PAY UP POMPEY, POMPEY PAY UP (new pompey chimes officially sanctioned)
Jinkin Jimmy Dimmock
For those who havent seen it b4. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=73j30gJJhS0
Super Bock 1898
Blues first - I went on the forum on this site in the summer expressing my sympathy with Southampton, even though I've been brought up on the blue side of the bitter rivalry for years. And I was not the only one. But I was then rightly reminded of the bitter venom that came our way from them last time we were in trouble, and I remember myself they way they tried to lord it over us when they were in the top flight and we weren't. Whatever problems Pompey may have at the moment, I know I speak for the rest when I say we are proud to be Pompey blue and not "that lot down the road".
tracyc
AND we know administration is a real possibility. We know it carries a points deduction. We know we are likely to be relegated anyway, and certain if we go into administration. But if/when that happens, we won't be winging that 'it isn't fair', trying to appeal on a ludicrous technicality or expecting that the rules shouldn't apply to us. (sound like anyone located near us?) Just as we haven't done about the transfer embargo.
tracyc
Jimmy, how long did that 'gem' take you to think up...

buzz, to be fair i do not think it is fair to blame SAF for the mess, perhaps not being able to clear it up is his - and then others' fault - altho is is without a doubt sacha's fault as he put us in this mess even if he does not think he did and some pompey fans now believe him!
pompeyrug
Superbock, I had only seen that very recently, I believe its done the rounds and been amended for different clubs, but its still very funny! Back to topic - I am still concerned about the possibility of 10% ownership taking on 10% of the debt, and I would urge that we get a bit more clarifiation on this. Like, from a lawyer. But I do like the idea of the trust having a stake in the club and at least a voice on the board, and it certainly seems, on the face of it, to be an excellent gesture by Fahim.
tracyc
 

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